This is going to sound like a sulky thread, but it isn't :D Honest 8-) I also thought of putting this in the Barriers part of the change in benefits section.
I was speaking to the beaver leader in the local supermarket and she was saying how she had less than half in beavers yesterday.
Scouts - all the sections is now £8 a month. Sounds horrendous, and most covers insurances. Leaders don't get paid, although we do get a shirt and Necker :roll:
A number of the children come from a Communities First area. They receive extra funding. In the summer holidays, they went daily to a local outdoor activities centre. This must have cost over £100 per child. They went to Alton Towers, a local attraction (that would cost me £50 to get my lot into), they went to a climing wall and an activity centre in the mountains.
They must have had about £800 per child allocated to them. Not to mention food provided and the leaders. The parents of the children who took part are in receipts of benefits. How nice that these parents - whether a two-parent or lone-parent family - had their children entertained and out of their hair for virtually the whole of the holidays.
So why would the parents want to pay £8 a month, plus activities, when they can have all this for free?
Why would these parents want to go to work and loose all these "perks"? I mean wow! It's absolutely fantastic for the children, and I know they had a great time.
However, I'm on income support. My children have had one day out to an air museum which was free (long way to go though, so fuel costs), and then shopping on Tuesday an hour aways so we could meet up with a friend.
My arguement here is not that my children didn't get to go on these things, but why should the children of parents who are in my situation have all these activities provided for free?
Another discussion here perhaps?
8-)
I like the idea of the MP letter - and might do that next. It is an EU funded project, I believe.
This is where I feel bad though, as I do understand boundaries. Being nasty again (I hate being nasty - honest), I have a neighbour opposite (the child that has caused so many problems). It's a housing association house, yet they hardly sleep there. The lad is in Beavers, and the address held is for the communities first area :o . I only know as I told the beaver leader that the lad lived opposite me, and she said no he doesn't...
What can you do there? His mum has a new partner. This lad's (and his little sister, we think) dad drives a new BMW. He paid for the new car window that the lad smashed... so he is a brilliant dad, and sees a lot of the child/ren (which makes us think the little girl is his :roll: )
I just feel with that many extras to be had that it will not be encouraging anyone back into work. I don't think it should be offered! I'd rather see the money take pensioners out for a day to Llandudno - they've worked and paid their taxes etc, why shouldn't they be the ones who have these days out?
I can understand how your mum feels too. I'm a supporter of means testing.
I feel 'free' things have gone too far. Perscriptions are free in Wales. My mum used to say that so many people have free perscriptions (it will be 13 years at Chirstmas since she died), that if everyone paid 50p per item that the system would be in profit!
My dad, I always felt was almost a communist, and having gone through the past few years, and lived amongst the mega rich in Rhosneigr, I am far more sympathetic than I used to be! 8-)
These children will 'expect' to be catered for. My lot realise you have to save and if the money isn't there, then we don't have that day out! Which is right? Even when I was married I was broke!! :D I've always been able to buget though...
Ooh sparklinglime, do the letter to the MP as you raise some really good points.
It is SOO frustrating when people use other people addresses to their advantage. It would be interesting to find out if Housing Benefit were paying for her house, because if she were claiming to be living there, but then using someone else's address, I am sure they would not be amused. PS I do not see your frustration at this as being nasty, I think it is more the injustice of someone taking the mickey out of the systems in place to get as much as they can. Where as others of us, try and live as honestly as possible.
I love the idea of petrol vouchers and bus passes for the families on low income, this makes much more sense, although I think that when we are pensioners, there will be very few benefits left for us to claim. I think that is why the Childrens Trust Fund started and parents were expected to invest it wisely, as that is what those children will be living on in their 70's.
I like what you say about the 50p per prescription, although I don't think it would go down well with the queue for methadone at my local pharmacy!
I think by teaching our children that you have to work and save, then you can have what you desire, is a far more preferable option than showing them that everything is out there for the taking by any means necessary. It means that we raise responsible adults not scroungers or thieves.
While I'm being nasty about those opposite :roll:
They were in a council house. The son set fire to his bedroom so they were re-housed.
Now had my child set fire to a room in the jokingly referred to 'family home', we wouldn't have been re-housed. One thing the house being destroyed, but it seems (listening to gossip, sorry, but this person was their neighbour, youngest friends with his son) the damage wasn't very great - they just wanted to move.
There's over 80 families in B&B in this area (don't take that as accurate), yet people playing the system are not considering anyone else.
I'll add letter to MP to my list. I need to do the Scouts stuff first. :roll:
I got a lot from communities first while living in Pencraig, in Llangefni, very near to you I know sparklinglime, I can appreciate your frustration.. but having been on the receiving end.. and I realise only through luck of geographical location.. and I was put there by emergency houseing and what have you.. but I was quite happy.
During summer 07 we did a lot, me and the kids and it was good for them, if not me.
I'm sure the funding came from the EEC and was all about putting money into deprived areas.. and I would say that Penraig is one, like Meas G in Bangor, very run down council estates and I can see where they were trying to go but ultimately just throwing money at somewhere for a few years doesn't do anything in the long run.
Now that the funding has gone these places are still the same.
Good point bubblegum, that is what is so crazy about funding, it always runs out, it needs to be sustainable for the 'project' to work.
Glad you got some of the benefits though.
I got a lot from communities first while living in Pencraig, in Llangefni, very near to you I know sparklinglime, I can appreciate your frustration.. but having been on the receiving end.. and I realise only through luck of geographical location.. and I was put there by emergency houseing and what have you.. but I was quite happy.
During summer 07 we did a lot, me and the kids and it was good for them, if not me.
I'm sure the funding came from the EEC and was all about putting money into deprived areas.. and I would say that Penraig is one, like Meas G in Bangor, very run down council estates and I can see where they were trying to go but ultimately just throwing money at somewhere for a few years doesn't do anything in the long run.
Now that the funding has gone these places are still the same.
Quite, it doesn't improve things. It's the same as it was when I was growing up! Is it deprived? The houses are all well built, with double glazing, new doors, kitchens and bathrooms.
Had the parents gone with them, I might not feel quite as I do... I just don't feel the parents are put in the position where they need to interact with the children. Doing the scouts now, I could have cried - eight year-olds walking down on their own - to me, I don't feel it's right. We sent a letter out to ask parents to come - older siblings came instead. They're fantastic children too.
Perhaps family based acitivities would work better?
MaesG has a fantastic community spirit. I worked with a few in Tesco who were involved in organising the activities. I guess there too it would be those who wanted to join in who would.
I'd love to try and set up something on this estate, and if we do have an Indian Summer I'm going to have a street party! Even if it's must my lot and my next door neighbour.
My parents worked when I was growing up, so I was a latch-key kid. I was always determined that if I had children I'd be there with them - especially when they're ill. Hence working from home for a few years and then the nights.
I doubt there are any answeres.
I agree sparkling, it would be great to include the familys. Not only would it be good for them to get out and about and have new experiences, it might mean that some people learn how to interact with their children better.
Fingers crossed for the Indian summer next year!!
High-pressure coming over on Wednesday, it seems. Was telling my neighbour my plans earlier. Just I can't next weekend - there's a scout camp, and while I'm not camping (no en-suite!) I need to go to drop two of mine off and then go on Saturday to cook :roll: So long as it's on the level!
Hi sparkling lime
I remember we touched on this topic before when you were anticipating the summer holidays. One on hand I think it is wonderful that children from lower income families can have these opportunities. The difficulty comes with "line-drawing" Lines always have to be drawn somewhere...we only have to think of things like Housing Benefit (my bugbear, that when people start work they lose so much of it!) and when announcements are made each year in the Budget. But lines inevitably exclude some people unfairly, and so you have a family like yours who have the low income but live just outside the designated area. Once upon a time, you could become a "family in need" with Social Services and get extra help and activities but even that seems to be virtually impossible.
On a practical note, it is worth seeeing if there is a Lions Club or similar in your area and seeing if they would be interested in running a trip for lower income families OUTSIDE that "designated" area. And how about a letter to your local MP? I can really see you as a campaigner! :)
Getting back to the debate, it seems to me to be one which runs throughout all sectors of society. For example, my elderly mum who has been very frugal and saved all her life now sees her peers getting lots of extra help and handouts becasue they have not saved. I did point out to her that it could be that they were not in a position to save anything, but for her it still rankles. My other personal bugbear is the over 60s automatically getting free bus travel, I feel this should be means-related so that lower-income over-60s and those with families, such as yourself sparkling lime, can get free travel and those over 60 who are well-off should pay instead. And that includes my Mum! Also, those who have to run a car because their public transport is poor, should get petrol tokens instead.
Is the Communities First an EU project, sparkling? And what do you think about the MP letter idea?